The Art of Natural Dressage

Since I started AND, my longreining has been a bit of a struggle... I don't know how to deal with it AND style. In my head keeps spinning that a big deal in longreining is actually your reins, so pressure on the horses' head. With less pressure as possible but still pressure.

A big thing is ofcourse where I stand when, for example. When I take the outside position (next to the fence) in the corner, she'll go in a shoulder in. When I take the outside position somewhat earlier she'll start sideways away from the fence, so I use that.
Another thing is voice cues, which I use all the time.

So what I do now is less pressure as possible; and when I ask, ask not more then three times and don't ask louder, when she refuses she'll have her reasons and I stop asking... think of something different.

But in my head is still... the pressure, as little as it is... it is pressure. Even though the 'method' I use is about letting the horse go and stand on his own four feet, only interfere while asking but not "push him through" an exercise.

Ofcourse, it's bitless.

So, anyone with same/other struggles concerning longreining? Or anyone with comments. I'd love it.

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kirsten
time is what you make of it

If you, like me, have trouble getting all control freaky as soon as you have reins attached to your hands
Adjust the reins to a cordeo and there you go.

Karen has an excellent video on this, maybe pm her to place it here?

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www.equusuniversalis.com

I don't know about "excellent" LOL...Here is the link:

Tamarack with the Driving Cordeo

I made a cordeo with two rings so I could attach the long lines.

And my "long lines" are actually an old set of draw reins...a much nicer use for them, don't you think?

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"Ride reverently, as if each step is the axis on which the earth revolves"

In the diary of Els and Amiro there is also a lot of info (and pictures!) about longreining with a cordeo, starting on page 2.

Hmm, I'd love to try this one day soon!

Sure, I'll psot pictures and video's but I'm afraid it'll be a disaster, but on the other hand... we should just start from the very first beginning again and see what happens. Doubting why it should be a disaster :P

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kirsten
time is what you make of it

All you have to do is take it slow...a few steps at a time, and you have to be patient to give your horse the time to understand to turn. It's a LOT of start and stop (reward), start and stop (reward).

You know the drill... If your horse gets stuck, just lay down the reins and go take direct hold of the cordeo to remind them that a light pull on one side means to turn. BUT...remember that with the long lines you are actually pulling BACK on one side, so they need to understand that different feel when the long reins are on.

Tam just surprised me by also be quite sensitive and reacting to the touch of the rein on his hip...so I had to keep the reins quite open unless I also wanted to move his hip over. But in realizing this, I could then play with combinations of hip and neck touches. If he got frustrated I would try and change my position behind him to see if that would help...and he seems to prefer that I move to the inside of turn if I want him to turn...and for half pass, I stay on the outside hip a little.

There are many things to play with in this. I will certainly look forward to your reports and pics and videos!!! HAVE FUN!

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"Ride reverently, as if each step is the axis on which the earth revolves"

Hey,

Cordeolongreining is really great!
It's gonna take some exercise for me to find the right position and for her to not turn around straight away, but other then that... really... we're gonna make it

The first thing she did was go into sideways... I just didn't even ask for something

And then we had the problem with walking away from me, which now she understand she can do. Her transitions were better (to say, they were there... her transition to a trot was quick and her trot was the same as a fast walk for me!) then with a bridle. And... something I was worried about... her bending in the curves is way better on cordeo then on sidepull. She had some trouble making the turn (or I had some trouble finding the right position) but in the end we could make perfect s's and turning and all... we did some really cool sideways! It's gonna take some practise but if this is the first time... I think we'll just have to do it more often.

Ofcourse I have everything on Camera

Or so I thought because when I wanted to put off the camera it already was off, or as i discovered when I looked back the tape, it was never turned on

But... definitely to be continued....

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kirsten
time is what you make of it

I am following this topic with interest, because I was unsure if you meant long reins as in you do groundwork holding the reins above the wither or longlines where you effectively teach the horse the basics of driving.
I have seen Simon Mullholland's Saddle Charriots but cannot afford one, but with a Cob and a Shire, both designed for pulling and being free to trot and explore that way I am tempted to consider an exercise cart of some type for the future.
My previous horses did lunge whilst walking forward through fields and longline, all in preparation for ridden work.
With these bitless young horses I was reluctant to longline because I want to keep their heads free as balancing poles and effect their outline through their bodies, if that makes sense.
So keep posting, really enjoying the tips, references to topics and videos and help.
Thanks,
Susie xx

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Susie xx
http://www.flickr.com/photos/piepony/

if you wanna do this in a save area there is no problem. And can be great :-) but if you wanna use this for training i mean preparing to carriage driving then i would say use a good bridle and dont worry to much about the AND way.
that mean not that you have to push and pull and so on. Even driving can carefull and give the horse enough space to move their heads. If you look to Simon for example, His obahma is driving with a rope halter, tho he is learning him now with a Cook bridle.
Because he knows that you can do some bit more finetuning if needed.
But still then the horse have plenty of space to be himself.

i am driving almost every day and the pony never complained about the less of room for his head or that it is too strong / hard for him.
And yes he will when he doesn't like it. and i accept that, he know that for sure.
I know that because when he is not in the mood he can walk away from the beginning and we wont go driving.
Or when i ask a trot and he will stay in walk even after several questioning then we stay in walk. He have a reason for that i think.
So he get the freedom to do so. Most of the time later on he ask if he may go harder. and i say yes when it is save enough.
So both are happy then, it think
why would a good bridle reduce the happyness of a horse?
i think if you are realy good you can do long reining with nothing. it is then no longer reining but stearing your horse from behind or am i wrong??

Well, it's not the purpose for Ruphina to go on the street like this! It' not even the purpose for her to pull a carriage. It's longreining in the sense of I'm walking behind her and she can do the exercises to grow stronger and straighter without me on her back
more like this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIuC1A9MR24.

This is actually also my position, somewhat more forward to her shoulder... but I try to keep this one.
And though this man teaches to let go of your reins as much as possible, (let the horse walk on it's own feet it doesn't need corrections or guiding when he's doing fine) I still felt I was controlling to much and Ruphina her transitions were gone (she hardly ever went into trot) her sideways were not happy but a bit mad and agitated.

After longreining with just a cordeo I can say that time her transitions were way better, down as well as up so that must be a relieve. Her sideways were everywhere... I mean... they were so easy, without guiding her every step (which first had to be done with a bridle) she made them really nicely. The only problem was steering, I suppose she didn't get the vue for that right away. But in the end we made perfect turns and changed sides (Which in the beginning she would go and stand still and turn with me...) so it's just another progress of adjusting to small cues and me getting the know where to stand in order to get what movement, lots of food and rewards.

I fully understand the warning when it comes to pulling a carriage on the street! And it's totally true. But Ruphina and pulling the carriage is not really what we're searching for... maybe later when we can get her to relax while riding outside on the street
But outside riding I still do with my sidepull for securanceofficebureaucratic reasons, and well.. I still feel it's saver for me but mostly for the ones around me (I'm not responsible for only me and Ruphina but for a lot more people, animals, material stuff)

Maybe I'll try again today and make sure the video is turned on filming and recording and on

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kirsten
time is what you make of it

ah it is clear now for me. And yes Piet he is great!! i have met him for several times and have seen him working with several different horses. I like him, he is very inspiring and he will work bitless too. tho it is not AND but he can explain what the meaning is and how the horse have to move and why, what effect it has on the horses muscles and so on.
He is very active and talk with his whole body to activate you also

I do what you wanted to do pretty often because i can ride my horse every day, but still wanna do each time something differrent.
i use sometimes a bridle and sometime a cordeo and sometime nothing, this will ends most of the time in a rough play

Well my first movie of the longreining...
Euhm... well, what to say? I'll add the comment later (in a hurry to go to school in time right now ) But just needed to add!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1nrrpWSsVbU

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kirsten
time is what you make of it

for the first time yes

Kirsten that is beautiful, and I love the gentle, polite way Ruphina takes treats, head away before receiving. I am trying to instill this in my boys, and to be fair they are mostly good, but my 2 year old sometimes forgets and tries to put his nose on my body, even though he has no reward until the muzzle is back where it belongs.
Something for me to aim for. Well done to you. xx

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Susie xx
http://www.flickr.com/photos/piepony/

Well, thank you. I must say, I see it quite the other way. Ruphina can become really pushy when it comes to treats, so I make big deal of only giving her treats when in ramener, or when lowering her head (this last one mostly when we're in wild plays and before getting overexcited).
But thank you, we just started it and she gets on with it pretty well!
We also have this ritual when giving her her diner. I put th ebucket with food down and she has to wait 'till I step back and say "here you go" this because she can be quite aggressive when it comes to food
so, its lost of practise but she's a fast learner.

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kirsten
time is what you make of it