The Art of Natural Dressage

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 Post subject: 2: Jambette
PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 9:01 pm 

Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2007 10:12 pm
Posts: 29
Location: Utrecht, The Netherlands
Hi, Since I'm new to all this stuff I thought it may be a good idea to start with something 'simple'like he Jambette.

How do you learn your horse to do that?
(your horse has to straighten a leg forward right?)

another question: Do you guys use clickers/food or a voicereward or something to teach your horse the exercises?

thank you for reading!

Greetz Jasmijn


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 9:57 pm 
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Hi Jasmijn,

I think there are at least three ways:

1. Touching the horse's leg with a stick or with your hand
2. Letting her target something with her leg
3. Mimicry (showing her the movement by doing it yourself)

Personally I prefer mimicry, but you have to see what works best for the two of you.

In each case the most important thing is to reward the slightest try. Even if she only shifts her weight to the other leg in the beginning or moves her hoof a little bit. Soon she will begin to offer more.

Concerning your question about the reward: I think that I can say that everybody here uses rewards. Some people "only" use scratches or nice words, but many people also use food rewards. We have a lot of clickertrainers here. What you use as a reward depends, besides other facts, on what Keri likes.

So there are lots of things to experiment on. 8) Have fun!!


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 10:09 pm 

Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2007 10:12 pm
Posts: 29
Location: Utrecht, The Netherlands
Hi,

Thank you for your answer!
I think i'll try to touch her leg with a whip and then do de mimickry. So that later on she'll know what to do.
With the reward, i'm just gonna try what works best, i'll let you know how it goes :P .


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 10:45 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2007 8:31 pm
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I think the jambette is the exercise that is the nicest, easiest and usefullest of the 'stretching'-things. You can build it out on so many ways, spanish walk, trot, polka, and maybe even the galop on three legs or pirouette with one leg high.

I'm learning it to Missy now, just started with it one time, and she immediately understanded what I ment. I touched her leg (low), she lifted her hoof a little bit, I 'clacked' with my tongue (that's my clickersound) and gave her a piece of carrot.
After 5 minutes, she knew that if I point to her hoof, I ask her to lift it.

It's not really stretched at the moment, only the lifting, but when you only reward your horse for the stretching-moments (when she know the cue well), she'll understand you very soon..

I think it's nice to change the cue to mimickry at a later moment, but now I started with 'pointing', and I think it's a little bit confusing for her to have two cues, to be honest..

I'm not very experienced at teaching horses the Jambette, Missy is only my 3th horse (to teach it), but if I were you, I would choose one cue for it, so that it's clear for her what you mean, and you can ask it quick for her, instead of having a whole ritual of touching and lifting your own leg. :)
(But I would like to read some other opinions from the more advanced in this. Because this is only a tought from me, I don't know if it's true what I'm saying :P )

Succes with this nice exercise!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 2:45 pm 

Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2007 10:12 pm
Posts: 29
Location: Utrecht, The Netherlands
Hi everybody,

Today I went and tried the jambette with Fleur, I visited her today. I touched her leg with a whip, and for a couple of time's she lifted her leg, so I gave the cue and then gave her a peace of carrot. When she lifted her leg about 3 times orso she didn't want to lift her leg anymore. After that I stopped asking her.

Do you think that she was bored or that I should try it with my hand, like, Myukii, or that she just didn't get me?

I don't have the chance to practice a lot with her, but I will try to teach Keri also the jambette, so maybe I know what to do better next time.

I hope you have a answer for me :) !

Kind regards,

Jasmijn

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 3:23 pm 
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Try touching or tickling (try not to tap) lighlty in different places. Or you can try a couple of times on one leg and then go to the other side of the horse and try the other leg.

Sometimes it is not boredom, but it may take them a while to understand the direct path from touch=leg lift=carrot.

Just take your time and each time you visit with her, try again.

Cisco's "jambette" button is at the very top of his leg, and almost on the shoulder!


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 5:20 pm 

Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2007 10:12 pm
Posts: 29
Location: Utrecht, The Netherlands
Ok, thanks :D .
This is also good to train my own (in)patients :oops: :P .

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 24, 2008 5:19 pm 
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Location: Belgium/Tielt-Winge
Beau has really mastered the jambette with his right leg, it is high, stretched and he can hold ti long. The left side is much more difficult, and so he tends to offer the right side. My cue is voice with lifting my own leg and touching the shoulder I want lifted. But Beau tries the easy leg... So I say jambette, lift my left leg, touch the left shoulder and before the left 'sort of jambette ' comes he lifts right first 3 or 4 times, then gets frustrated and does an ugly left jambette, a lot of times followed by a stump on the ground.

How can I get them equal?
Not rewarding the right one anymore? rewarding more for a left one?

He really blows himself up because he finds it difficult.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 24, 2008 5:47 pm 
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Barbara, Freckles is/was exactly the same! When Josepha was here she said he needed to do a lot of deep carrot-stetches - almost like starting a bow - to lengthen his top-line and open his shoulders.

It has helped soooo much!

Also I took his left leg in my hands a few times and gently "helped" him stretch forward and up. He is improving so quickly it's hard to believe, but I do see that he needs to lean quite far to the right to get his left leg up? In the beginning I had to "show" him that lifting his head would make it easier? And I find he does the left leg best if I back him a step or two before I ask?

I don't know if any of this will help at all ...

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 24, 2008 6:12 pm 
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Another way to do the stretching that Glen describes is to use a pedestal...only not the kind to stand on, but the kind you put a foot up on. I taught this to Cisco and that is probably why he has a jambette and Tam doesn't...because I didn't teach this to Tam :idea: !

Anyway, start low, and when the horse puts a foot on it, then you lure the horse's head down between his front legs with a treat. It helps them stretch. Again, start with a low pedestal, then gradually work toward taller pedestals (this is the hard part...finding ways to make higher pedestals).

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 24, 2008 7:18 pm 
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Barbara wrote:
How can I get them equal?
Not rewarding the right one anymore? rewarding more for a left one?

He really blows himself up because he finds it difficult.


Good ideas from other so far with stretching and pedestals and all...

And I do think that focusing on the 'weaker' leg for a while and withholding reinforcement for the strong one does help with balancing out left and right behaviors!!!!

So say for a week? only reinforce the left?? And also keep a high rate of reinforcement at first, reinforce the left simply for effort, so he begins to realize that the left leg is also an 'opportunity for reinforcement', and also so doesn't get frustrated??

Brenda

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 24, 2008 9:20 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 16, 2007 7:51 pm
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Location: Netherlands
All the great advice is already given, 8) so all I can add is that you can also use a target to equalize both jambettes. If you reward Beau as soon as he touches (on your old cues) with his knee a target that you dangle in front of his leg (first very close to his leg, later on you lift it higher and higher so that the leg will follow upwards), then pretty soon he will get more confident about which leg you mean, and it will also be quite easy to get both jambettes as high as the other.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 27, 2008 8:05 pm 
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Location: Belgium/Tielt-Winge
thanks for all the advice!
I'll try it out as soon as I get the time and I'll keep you guys posted on it :)

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2009 5:35 pm 
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Location: Belgium/Tielt-Winge
Thanks for the help!!!
I put a target ( my whip) in front of his leg and he instantly got it :)
yeay!!! :applause:

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2009 6:23 pm 
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:applause: :applause: :applause:

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